forums : Jungle Scene

the politics of drum n bass

I've been meaning to post this for some time now. it goes like this...

drum n bass. the music that in many cases. changed my feelings and views towards not only the other geners that i've listen to and grown to love/hate, but also in ways changed the way i think and feel about a lot of subjects in my life. now, some of you may think that's strange or wierd. but it's true. i would have never thought that fast beats around 170-175, minor keys, heavy basslines, or even twisted amens could impact my life. and that's only a small fraction of what seems like a journey into constand evolving world of dnb.

i've meet people(thanks to the internet) globally that share the same views about various things. especially the 'scene'.

and there is the problem. no that the scene is expanding through the net, but it is the politcs that are involved.

now... you may be asking.."politics, what politics?" i've recently come across a thread entitled "the london/world devide" on doa. to make a long story short. it's basically an us vs uk dnb thread. though it is not entitled. but it is how it evolved. there are people who claims that the us started dnb,but then the uk some how stole it, and now we(as being producers of dnb in the us) are now stealing it back.

what in the hell kind of nonsense is this. then it goes to how the uk scene sucks, then again to how the us scene sucks ass. and this is based on a couple of bad tunes. when you ask the person to reference, they will bring out tunes that are old or overplayed.

now instead of venting on that. i've began thinking. back when the scene was "raw" meaning fairly new to the globe, people came to know and appreciate dnb as an art. not just music. comming from a producer, i especially feel that it's an art, considering all the time, effort, and energy put into making drum n bass. instead of being appreciative, now a days, it seems like politics regarding drum n bass is starting to take over the scene. i've heard all kinds of crap regarding the dubplate conspirices, other crap regarding the riaa, and other nonsense. seems like people really don't think about what is important anymore, just stupid theories,and the like. anyhoo. im venting a little too much.

it's your turn.

what do you think is wrong with theh scene as of now?

Re: the politics of drum n bass

i think its good actually. this isn't some lets put on a fake smile kinda stuff, I think it is good, good talent rolling through, some nice venues too, you know. I only wish that the various genres of electronic music weren't so separated. Its like you gotta make a choice what kinds of music you want to hear that night, dnb, breaks, house. I wish there was a multi-room club in la that had some banging music of all types. As it stands I don't know too many like that, and going to a venue like the orion usually means all the music there (though varied) usually isn't that good.

Re: the politics of drum n bass

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According to alias_9 ...

people came to know and appreciate dnb as an art.
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i think with art usually comes unity. and with commodities (commercial things) often comes competition. ragga vs. tech debates are competition. uk vs. us debates are competition. all that talk is superficial. true art has no labels. art is just that - art.

also it seems like some people want to prove themselves by being d'n'b experts. so in doing so they try to bring a lot of other people down. that's another problem, trying to bring yourself up by bringing others down. competition, not unity.

i look at it like this: if all i do is try to big up myself and what i do it's not going to amount to much in the big picture. but if i can help out everybody, raise the standard for things, then EVERYTHING gets brought up.

politically speaking, i think it's a bunch of bulls**t and has no place in our scene. i think all that really matters is what people bring to the table and that's where respect should come from.

Re: the politics of drum n bass

i agree with socal so much . we all as a whole need to stop worring about coming up so much and just respect others work and stop being so judgemental

Re: the politics of drum n bass

easier said than done dont ya think?

it's easy for people to say that others need to not put down others. it's very easy to say what we as a people need to do, but then when it comes to appling those actions. then what was once easy is now rather difficult.

now im not directing this statement at anyone here, or anywhere else. but too often do i see/hear/read about people who some how "knows" what's best for others. but when it comes time to practice what they preach, they tend to make excuses for their actions, instead of admiting that they are wrong.

let's face it. it's human nature to recognize the bad than the good.

and i would agree, that's one of the major problems with the scene today.

what do you think?

Re: the politics of drum n bass

you asked the question "what do you think is wrong with theh scene as of now?" i answered it straight up.

you ask me what i think? i think civilization puts too much of an emphasis on hypocrasy. likes it's the root of all evil or something. of course it's good to back up your words with action. it adds so much more emphasis to the words. but regardless the words are better than nothing because they transmit thoughts. and positive thoughts spreading from one mind to another is positive, regardless if one person is talking out of their ass. like for instance if an alcoholic goes around telling people that drinking is bad, would you call them a hypocrite? some people learn from their mistakes and want to prevent others from doing the same while their action are out of control. also, i think sometimes hypocrites are really talking to themselves aloud. it's a vent of sorts, because once the words are there the actions follow. positive thoughts influence positive words which influence positive action.

[ socaljungle.com - 19 Dec 2003 22:39 ]

Re: the politics of drum n bass

point noted. though the last statement wasn't pointed at you. just relating to the topic at hand=]

Re: the politics of drum n bass

=]

Re: the politics of drum n bass

I think that dnb comes from a different tradition that really emphasizes skills and the idea of "proper jungle" and that these ideas are inherrant to jungle. This is kind of an offshoot of DJ culture and hip hop culture where you're either tight or wack: there sometimes is no middle ground. It is less tolerant of mediocrity and if you put out music or perform, you must be ready to accept criticism, sometimes harsher criticism than you see in other styles of music. It seems messed up, but the collective effect is to make jungle maintain its quality standards and not be coopted by the mainstream. People just need to have thick skin and be playful with it. Think of b-boys battling in a competition, they try to show each other up or dis each other on the mic, but still can smile and shake hands at the end of the day.

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According to unruly...

think that dnb comes from a different tradition that really emphasizes skills and the idea of "proper jungle" and that these ideas are inherrant to jungle.

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interesting. "proper jungle". if you think about it. the only ones who can not only define the term, but carry it's meaning are the origional junglist themselves. and you are 100% correct. dnb does come from an entirely different tradition than other geners.

indeed. i like your way of thinking...

Re: the politics of drum n bass

"shut the f**k up and dance"

Re: the politics of drum n bass

You cant dance on a message board. Relax. Let them f**king talk.

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According to thepoet ...

"shut the f**k up and dance"
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I'm with poet on this one. Some peaple just have to much time on their hands.
It is art. Now Just sit back and enjoy it...when a producer puts together a tune, hes not thinking about all this bulls**t. He just wants to make a sick track...

Re: the politics of drum n bass

I was reading this thread and was trying to figure out what I thought was wrong with our scene, and really... I like our scene a lot. I mean look at some of the other "rave" scenes... house / trance has become super commercialized and mainstream now, I mean f**k I walk past Abercrombie & Fitch everyday on my way to work, and hear some trance track bumping... walk past Gap and hear some house playing... I like that our scene is known, but not... something to conform to. For the most part Junglist IMO are the most chilll heads at parties. We appreciate music a little more, we appareciate dance a little more, we appreciate talent a little more, and for those of us who get s**tty... we know how to do it with style . I get so tired of seeing heaps and heaps of candy kids in the middle of the floor of the trance room, bitching about how they are getting kicked and stepped on... people should go to parties for the music and talent, not to sit on the floor pilled out for days. Rarely do I see a junglist inebriated in the middle of the floor, rarely do I see a group of highschool cheerleaders at their first rave in the jungle room... they are all in the house room or trance room eating *gasp* Ecstasy... because it's what society says ravers do... Pop pills and listen to that crazy techno music... Jungle is an aquired taste... rarely do I see someone in the jungle room who... stands out... by not fitting in. That alone makes me happy with our scene. We arent commercial, we aren't "the cool thing to be" or "the cool music listen to"... the jungle scene is pure... well the most pure of all other "rave" scenes IMO... we're f**kin old skool. When people ask me how ya dance to jungle, or why I like it... complaining about how it's to fast... I don't understand em, or what they are asking... maybe I just think at 170bpm... feel sorry for those mainstream commercialized bastards down at 130... I think there is far more right about our scene than wrong with it, so maybe I'm just not up to the challenge of picking it apart, or maybe I just focus on whats right, not whats wrong... or maybe I'm just too damn high right now... sorry for any confusion I may have caused, just my opinions through a haze of bong smoke...

*it's only wrong if you get caught*

Re: the politics of drum n bass

who cares just go out and have fun?

Re: the politics of drum n bass

it looks like ten people care enough to respond on this thread, worry about yourself.

Re: the politics of drum n bass

Let's judge how much people care by how many responses a thread gets!

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According to unifire ...

it looks like ten people care enough to respond on this thread, worry about yourself.
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I think there is far more right about our scene than wrong with it, so maybe I'm just not up to the challenge of picking it apart, or maybe I just focus on whats right, not whats wrong
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nicely put!
I think by figuring out what is wrong and trying to change that keeps things moving in a forward motion [mostly], but let's not forget that there is a lot of good as well, and that good [imo] far outweighs the bad...

Re: the politics of drum n bass

It makes me really happy to see that other people care about this music as much as I do. As long as there's more cats like u guys, we got nothing to worry about.

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this same stuff goes on in every sort of music. its like being in a sandbox fighting...

people who appreciate MUSIC [in any form] aren't really as nationalistic or closed minded to one thing only.

You know whats sad tho? [and this goes for all music again]...the fact that people tend to settle down and be SPOONFED as to whats happening or what's good as opposed to seeking it out.

We all know the producers that've been around for 15 years...we know WMC...but what's REALLY brewing under the surface?

Do people go out to check out shows out of curiosiyt anymore? Or is it all based on how many reviews got burned onto the brain?

Re: the politics of drum n bass

there just needs to be more sincerity, and compassion. plain and simple.

Re: the politics of drum n bass

amen serum....